Comments on: Prescience (and uninformed speculation) http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/ European Opinion Sat, 22 Nov 2008 15:48:59 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: John Kwon http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4047 John Kwon Thu, 24 Jun 2004 20:11:20 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4047 I'm a little fuzzy on what the EU Constitution would mean (that's right, I haven't had time to read it). Would this mean that a country like France or Belgium would now be the equivalent of a US State in terms of its independence? Would it be possible for a country to later secede from the EU without provoking a war? They made a nice little group of States here on this side of the pond, and when some of the States decided that they wanted to quit the Union, it started a war. Anything in the EU Constitution about an exit clause? A safety valve of some sort? Considering the visibility that euro-skeptics are getting in the press, it may indeed come to pass one day (maybe years from now, after everyone is nice and comfortable) that one or more states might want to quit. Those sentiments are already out there, but they just don't have the momentum for the moment. I’m a little fuzzy on what the EU Constitution would mean (that’s right, I haven’t had time to read it). Would this mean that a country like France or Belgium would now be the equivalent of a US State in terms of its independence? Would it be possible for a country to later secede from the EU without provoking a war? They made a nice little group of States here on this side of the pond, and when some of the States decided that they wanted to quit the Union, it started a war.

Anything in the EU Constitution about an exit clause? A safety valve of some sort?

Considering the visibility that euro-skeptics are getting in the press, it may indeed come to pass one day (maybe years from now, after everyone is nice and comfortable) that one or more states might want to quit. Those sentiments are already out there, but they just don’t have the momentum for the moment.

]]> By: Bernard Guerrero http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4046 Bernard Guerrero Thu, 24 Jun 2004 00:16:30 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4046 Why, are most foreigners nasty? I thought the majority of the French-folk I met on my honeymoon were ok, apart from the fellow who offered us ketchup for our escargot. Though I'll give him points for a sense of humor, at least. The little list is, in actuality, fairly little. Why, are most foreigners nasty? I thought the majority of the French-folk I met on my honeymoon were ok, apart from the fellow who offered us ketchup for our escargot. Though I’ll give him points for a sense of humor, at least.

The little list is, in actuality, fairly little.

]]> By: Bob http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4045 Bob Wed, 23 Jun 2004 06:54:24 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4045 It might expedite matters if you just listed those you propose to exempt from mass extermination as that would seem to be the shorter list by several orders of magnitude. It might expedite matters if you just listed those you propose to exempt from mass extermination as that would seem to be the shorter list by several orders of magnitude.

]]> By: Bernard Guerrero http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4044 Bernard Guerrero Tue, 22 Jun 2004 23:17:21 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4044 Bob, "How can you say that? According to this unimpeachable source, Bush was on a divinely sanctioned mission in starting the Iraq war" What he _thinks_ is his problem. I'm just in favor of killing off lots of nasty foreigners. I don't care if it's God that tells him to do it or his dog. :^) Son of Bernard Bob,

“How can you say that? According to this unimpeachable source, Bush was on a divinely sanctioned mission in starting the Iraq war”

What he _thinks_ is his problem. I’m just in favor of killing off lots of nasty foreigners. I don’t care if it’s God that tells him to do it or his dog. :^)

Son of Bernard

]]> By: Aidan Kehoe http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4043 Aidan Kehoe Tue, 22 Jun 2004 16:52:10 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4043 Only communists need mental health hospitals! </elaboration> Only communists need mental health hospitals! </elaboration>

]]> By: Aidan Kehoe http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4042 Aidan Kehoe Tue, 22 Jun 2004 16:50:43 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4042 Of course, in most countries nowadays, people who feel impelled to start wars because they believe they hear voices from God usually get confined to secure mental health hospitals. Hey, shut up! Small government works! Of course, in most countries nowadays, people who feel impelled to start wars because they believe they hear voices from God usually get confined to secure mental health hospitals. Hey, shut up! Small government works!

]]> By: Bob http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4041 Bob Tue, 22 Jun 2004 14:01:40 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4041 "Not that the relatively minor issue of the Deity is really necessary to generate such a result... " How can you say that? According to this unimpeachable source, Bush was on a divinely sanctioned mission in starting the Iraq war: Bush said: "God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them." - from: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=310788&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y Of course, in most countries nowadays, people who feel impelled to start wars because they believe they hear voices from God usually get confined to secure mental health hospitals. “Not that the relatively minor issue of the Deity is really necessary to generate such a result… ”

How can you say that? According to this unimpeachable source, Bush was on a divinely sanctioned mission in starting the Iraq war:

Bush said: “God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them.” - from: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=310788&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

Of course, in most countries nowadays, people who feel impelled to start wars because they believe they hear voices from God usually get confined to secure mental health hospitals.

]]> By: Aidan Kehoe http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4040 Aidan Kehoe Tue, 22 Jun 2004 13:48:05 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4040 I think when it comes down to it the Poles will live without God in the EU constitution--it won't surprise them coming from an institution whose early first movers were France and Germany. My "fifty years down the road" comment was mostly a way of saying that there probably won't have been a Polish pope for a while at that point, and their current fervour will have eased off. Whether they will formally embrace secularism is another matter, and I don't think it's something that likely. I think when it comes down to it the Poles will live without God in the EU constitution–it won’t surprise them coming from an institution whose early first movers were France and Germany.

My “fifty years down the road” comment was mostly a way of saying that there probably won’t have been a Polish pope for a while at that point, and their current fervour will have eased off. Whether they will formally embrace secularism is another matter, and I don’t think it’s something that likely.

]]> By: Bernard Guerrero http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4039 Bernard Guerrero Tue, 22 Jun 2004 05:47:20 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4039 "Right, let's say something, then. JR; no, as you've probably worked out by this stage, the Poles didn't get the mention of Christianity in, much to Stefan Geens' relief. And, I'm sure, to their own relief fifty years down the road." Because they'll have moved on down the road of secularism by then, or because it means that the Constitution will never be accepted in a referendum and is likely DOA? :^) Not that the relatively minor issue of the Deity is really necessary to generate such a result... Bernard Guerrero, agnostic “Right, let’s say something, then. JR; no, as you’ve probably worked out by this stage, the Poles didn’t get the mention of Christianity in, much to Stefan Geens’ relief. And, I’m sure, to their own relief fifty years down the road.”

Because they’ll have moved on down the road of secularism by then, or because it means that the Constitution will never be accepted in a referendum and is likely DOA? :^) Not that the relatively minor issue of the Deity is really necessary to generate such a result…

Bernard Guerrero, agnostic

]]> By: Aidan Kehoe http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/prescience-and-uninformed-speculation/#comment-4038 Aidan Kehoe Tue, 22 Jun 2004 04:10:54 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=704#comment-4038 Bigre, qu'il nous manque de conversation. </strokey-beard>Right, let's say something, then. JR; no, as you've probably worked out by this stage, the Poles didn't get the mention of Christianity in, much to Stefan Geens' relief. And, I'm sure, to their own relief fifty years down the road.Has anyone seen a decent analysis of why Giscard d'Estaing didn't want Turkey in the EU on the basis of, pretty much, religion a year or so ago? Because that just threw me--if you're going to do the la?cit? thing, which, umm, France has for well over a century now, then do it consistently. And, yeah, good call Mr. Blair on putting off their referendum for another couple of years. It should be doable for them to win it--if Murdoch dies :-) . And, on a tangential issue, Nick Barlow links to a vaguely pro-EU column from, of all people, Jeremy Clarkson. I don't think ayone was expecting him to be a Michael Heseltine Tory. :-) Bigre, qu’il nous manque de conversation. </strokey-beard>Right, let’s say something, then. JR; no, as you’ve probably worked out by this stage, the Poles didn’t get the mention of Christianity in, much to Stefan Geens’ relief. And, I’m sure, to their own relief fifty years down the road.Has anyone seen a decent analysis of why Giscard d’Estaing didn’t want Turkey in the EU on the basis of, pretty much, religion a year or so ago? Because that just threw me–if you’re going to do the la?cit? thing, which, umm, France has for well over a century now, then do it consistently. And, yeah, good call Mr. Blair on putting off their referendum for another couple of years. It should be doable for them to win it–if Murdoch dies :-) . And, on a tangential issue, Nick Barlow links to a vaguely pro-EU column from, of all people, Jeremy Clarkson. I don’t think ayone was expecting him to be a Michael Heseltine Tory. :-)

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