Comments on: EU Constitution signing this morning http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/ European Opinion Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:35:26 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: Antoni Jaume http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/#comment-5308 Antoni Jaume Sun, 31 Oct 2004 01:49:39 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=892#comment-5308 mike d, while "proyecto" can indeed be used in the sense of a draft, the preferred word for that is "borrador", it is common to use "proyecto" until it is approved, even if there is no other amendment to be done. DSW mike d, while “proyecto” can indeed be used in the sense of a draft, the preferred word for that is “borrador”, it is common to use “proyecto” until it is approved, even if there is no other amendment to be done.

DSW

]]> By: mike d http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/#comment-5307 mike d Sat, 30 Oct 2004 02:42:03 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=892#comment-5307 Antoni: can't proyecto also be translated as "draft"? I think that's a better translation to english, but an odd one, as the signed treaty no longer is a "draft". is the Spanish govt going to try to get some wiggle room by telling those who don't like it to vote for it anyway- we can change it? just a thought- it's friday afternoon. Antoni:

can’t proyecto also be translated as “draft”? I think that’s a better translation to english, but an odd one, as the signed treaty no longer is a “draft”. is the Spanish govt going to try to get some wiggle room by telling those who don’t like it to vote for it anyway- we can change it?

just a thought- it’s friday afternoon.

]]> By: Antoni Jaume http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/#comment-5306 Antoni Jaume Sat, 30 Oct 2004 02:05:34 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=892#comment-5306 In Spain the the referendum is planned for the 20 of February 2005. The question would be "?Aprueba usted el proyecto de tratado por el que se establece una constituci?n para Europa?". My translation is "Do you approve of the project of treaty that establish an European Constitution?" From the link http://www.plus.es/codigo/noticias/ficha_noticia.asp?id=417151 DSW In Spain the the referendum is planned for the 20 of February 2005. The question would be “?Aprueba usted el proyecto de tratado por el que se establece una constituci?n para Europa?”. My translation is “Do you approve of the project of treaty that establish an European Constitution?”

From the link http://www.plus.es/codigo/noticias/ficha_noticia.asp?id=417151

DSW

]]> By: c http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/#comment-5305 c Sat, 30 Oct 2004 01:22:36 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=892#comment-5305 I think the plan is to hold a lot of referenda on the same day. After which there will be a lot of no answers and a forest was screwed to pulp for nothing I think the plan is to hold a lot of referenda on the same day. After which there will be a lot of no answers and a forest was screwed to pulp for nothing

]]> By: Scott Martens http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/#comment-5304 Scott Martens Fri, 29 Oct 2004 18:58:17 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=892#comment-5304 The signing ceremony is 50% symbolism, 50% bull. All it signifies is that the relevants heads of government of the member states are all willing to go to Rome for a free lunch. Before it can come into effect it has to be ratified. Since a number of countries intend to put ratification to a referendum, the situation is a bit sensitive. If even one country fails to ratify it, it will not come into effect. Ergo, once one country has held a referendum that fails to ratify it, there is no need for any of the other countries to go ahead with their referenda. Politicians in all those countries are then free to take either position - saying that they were for the EU constitution, but it was somebody else's fault that it failed, or that they were against it all along - without consequences. Only the first country to hold a failed referendum takes the political consequences. So, I suspect there will be a race to postpone referenda all over Europe until either someone else does it first or there is some real pressure to pass it. Either one country gets to take all the blame, or the people will not be allowed to vote on it until they've come to the preordained conclusion. It's not very democratic, but then few (if any) successful constitutional processes are very democratic. The signing ceremony is 50% symbolism, 50% bull. All it signifies is that the relevants heads of government of the member states are all willing to go to Rome for a free lunch. Before it can come into effect it has to be ratified. Since a number of countries intend to put ratification to a referendum, the situation is a bit sensitive. If even one country fails to ratify it, it will not come into effect. Ergo, once one country has held a referendum that fails to ratify it, there is no need for any of the other countries to go ahead with their referenda. Politicians in all those countries are then free to take either position - saying that they were for the EU constitution, but it was somebody else’s fault that it failed, or that they were against it all along - without consequences. Only the first country to hold a failed referendum takes the political consequences.

So, I suspect there will be a race to postpone referenda all over Europe until either someone else does it first or there is some real pressure to pass it. Either one country gets to take all the blame, or the people will not be allowed to vote on it until they’ve come to the preordained conclusion. It’s not very democratic, but then few (if any) successful constitutional processes are very democratic.

]]> By: Michael M. http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/the-european-union/eu-constitution-signing-this-morning/#comment-5303 Michael M. Fri, 29 Oct 2004 17:58:32 +0000 http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=892#comment-5303 Given that Britons are overwhelmingly against the constitution, and given that they will be called on to ratify it in 2006, what's going to happen if (when) they reject it? Given that Britons are overwhelmingly against the constitution, and given that they will be called on to ratify it in 2006, what’s going to happen if (when) they reject it?

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