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	<title>Comments on: Slovakia swings left</title>
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	<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/</link>
	<description>European Opinion</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 10:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: ricardus</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14962</link>
		<dc:creator>ricardus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Jul 2006 09:09:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14962</guid>
		<description>Meciar was a great prime minister. Remember when Czechoslovakia broke up, they said that Slovakia had no chance. Who would have guessed that Slovakia's economic growth would be the highest in Central Europe through the mid-1990s! (Some claim that Poland did a little better, but Slovakia certainly outpaced the Czechs) The Slovakian crown even overtook the Czech one. This was completely unexpected. Still, Slovakia was branded "the black hole" by Madeleine Albright.

I see the irrational hatred for Meciar and his great rule include comparing him with other good leaders; Milosevic and Lukashenko. These are others who decided that fire sales of national assets to foreigners was not a good idea and so their countries became "black holes" as a result.

The reason why Meciar has lost ground is twofold; one, the boycott organised by the US and EU since the 1998 elections and the rise of Fico who poached Meciar's voters frustrated by the obvious boycott policy and his yielding on matters like NATO membership under the pressure, trying desperately to no longer be shunned. Politicians could argue that they had to shun Meciar as a condition for joining the EU. Now that Slovakia is in the EU, that threat can no longer be made and Meciar's party can once again take its place as a ruling party.

I congratulate Fico for finally allowing a representative government to take its place in Bratislava, a government that is not cobbled together by interfering foreigners. Slovakia can again be an example to the world as it was under Meciar.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meciar was a great prime minister. Remember when Czechoslovakia broke up, they said that Slovakia had no chance. Who would have guessed that Slovakia&#8217;s economic growth would be the highest in Central Europe through the mid-1990s! (Some claim that Poland did a little better, but Slovakia certainly outpaced the Czechs) The Slovakian crown even overtook the Czech one. This was completely unexpected. Still, Slovakia was branded &#8220;the black hole&#8221; by Madeleine Albright.</p>
<p>I see the irrational hatred for Meciar and his great rule include comparing him with other good leaders; Milosevic and Lukashenko. These are others who decided that fire sales of national assets to foreigners was not a good idea and so their countries became &#8220;black holes&#8221; as a result.</p>
<p>The reason why Meciar has lost ground is twofold; one, the boycott organised by the US and EU since the 1998 elections and the rise of Fico who poached Meciar&#8217;s voters frustrated by the obvious boycott policy and his yielding on matters like NATO membership under the pressure, trying desperately to no longer be shunned. Politicians could argue that they had to shun Meciar as a condition for joining the EU. Now that Slovakia is in the EU, that threat can no longer be made and Meciar&#8217;s party can once again take its place as a ruling party.</p>
<p>I congratulate Fico for finally allowing a representative government to take its place in Bratislava, a government that is not cobbled together by interfering foreigners. Slovakia can again be an example to the world as it was under Meciar.</p>
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		<title>By: Colin Alberts</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14961</link>
		<dc:creator>Colin Alberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 01:34:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14961</guid>
		<description>Doug, I assume that the Christian Democrats of Slovakia are part of the mainstream of western European Christian Democracy, i.e. more like the CDU/CSU, the old French CDF or the reformed CDs of Italy, instead of more like these creepy reactionaries you see popping up in places like Poland or the like.  In other words, that they aren't a slightly more presentable version of the SNS.

If so, what are the possibilities of a SDKU+Hungarians+Christian Democrats, and then getting one or two members to flip?  Or is party discipline that strong in Slovakian parliamentarianism?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug, I assume that the Christian Democrats of Slovakia are part of the mainstream of western European Christian Democracy, i.e. more like the CDU/CSU, the old French CDF or the reformed CDs of Italy, instead of more like these creepy reactionaries you see popping up in places like Poland or the like.  In other words, that they aren&#8217;t a slightly more presentable version of the SNS.</p>
<p>If so, what are the possibilities of a SDKU+Hungarians+Christian Democrats, and then getting one or two members to flip?  Or is party discipline that strong in Slovakian parliamentarianism?</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Martens</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14960</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Martens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jun 2006 00:18:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14960</guid>
		<description>Will, I agree about Canadian conservatives.  Well, okay, I agree about 90%.  I know people from Alberta who would take mainstream US Republicans in a heartbeat.  Klein strikes me as someone who could fit into a "big tent" American Republican Party.

But outside southern Alberta and certain retrograde enclaves in Saskatchewan and Manitoba, you're right that US style conservatives are few and far between.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will, I agree about Canadian conservatives.  Well, okay, I agree about 90%.  I know people from Alberta who would take mainstream US Republicans in a heartbeat.  Klein strikes me as someone who could fit into a &#8220;big tent&#8221; American Republican Party.</p>
<p>But outside southern Alberta and certain retrograde enclaves in Saskatchewan and Manitoba, you&#8217;re right that US style conservatives are few and far between.</p>
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		<title>By: lemuel kolkava</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14959</link>
		<dc:creator>lemuel kolkava</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 23:55:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14959</guid>
		<description>Doug, well yes the turnout was lower, and yes some voters (not only SDKU voters, but voters in general) were disheartened, but mostly indeed not interested enough to participate. These were the very first Slovak elections without any major theme: the 1998 elections were about Meciar and democracy, the 2002 were about continuity of the reform process and the EU and NATO membership. The 2006 elections could once again be interpreted as being "about the reforms", but there was no such sharp polarisation as we were used to see before. It was not a life and death struggle. And under no stretch of imagination can the results be interpreted solely as a "rejection of reforms". 

Swing, as I understand it, constitues a change of heart on the part of the voters, but I really dont think that those who supported the Right in past elections moved to the Left. Of course I could be wrong, but if it were so, than SMER (which gained votes mainly from Meciar) would have even stronger showing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug, well yes the turnout was lower, and yes some voters (not only SDKU voters, but voters in general) were disheartened, but mostly indeed not interested enough to participate. These were the very first Slovak elections without any major theme: the 1998 elections were about Meciar and democracy, the 2002 were about continuity of the reform process and the EU and NATO membership. The 2006 elections could once again be interpreted as being &#8220;about the reforms&#8221;, but there was no such sharp polarisation as we were used to see before. It was not a life and death struggle. And under no stretch of imagination can the results be interpreted solely as a &#8220;rejection of reforms&#8221;. </p>
<p>Swing, as I understand it, constitues a change of heart on the part of the voters, but I really dont think that those who supported the Right in past elections moved to the Left. Of course I could be wrong, but if it were so, than SMER (which gained votes mainly from Meciar) would have even stronger showing.</p>
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		<title>By: Will</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14958</link>
		<dc:creator>Will</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 22:28:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14958</guid>
		<description>No, I have actually heard of David Frum. He became a US citizen in 2002, after having spent 20 years in the US. I guess I was being way too glib for my own good. 

The broader point that I was trying to make (that didn't come across at all) is that I always find it funny when other countries think their conservatives are too conservative.  I seriously doubt that Stephen Harper, and his people will become the neocons that the US has. I worked in Geneva during the spring and met a woman there who was born and raised in Quebec, and she was terrified of a Harper-led government. 

This always makes me laugh, because the mainstream "conservative" movements in Canada, Mexico, and Western Europe would be center or left of center in the US. Its just that there always seem to be this hyperbole that a conservative party is the worse thing in the world, but they don't realize that these "conservatives" would be moderate liberals in the US. 

It just cracks me up every time, when they think they got it bad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, I have actually heard of David Frum. He became a US citizen in 2002, after having spent 20 years in the US. I guess I was being way too glib for my own good. </p>
<p>The broader point that I was trying to make (that didn&#8217;t come across at all) is that I always find it funny when other countries think their conservatives are too conservative.  I seriously doubt that Stephen Harper, and his people will become the neocons that the US has. I worked in Geneva during the spring and met a woman there who was born and raised in Quebec, and she was terrified of a Harper-led government. </p>
<p>This always makes me laugh, because the mainstream &#8220;conservative&#8221; movements in Canada, Mexico, and Western Europe would be center or left of center in the US. Its just that there always seem to be this hyperbole that a conservative party is the worse thing in the world, but they don&#8217;t realize that these &#8220;conservatives&#8221; would be moderate liberals in the US. </p>
<p>It just cracks me up every time, when they think they got it bad.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug M.</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14957</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 21:09:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14957</guid>
		<description>@Yusuf, you're right, my bad.

@Lemuel, it's not only about percentage of votes.  The voter turnout dropped sharply this time too.  I'm not sure what this means -- where SDKU supporters disheartened?  Or was everybody just not that interested?  But anyway, when voters of the left (or right) unite instead of splitting their vote, I think it's fair to say that's a swing.

@Keith, I don't doubt they were at pains to stress it.  The Croats, Hungarians and Romanians say exactly the same thing.  Nobody wants to be in Eastern Europe.  


Doug M.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Yusuf, you&#8217;re right, my bad.</p>
<p>@Lemuel, it&#8217;s not only about percentage of votes.  The voter turnout dropped sharply this time too.  I&#8217;m not sure what this means &#8212; where SDKU supporters disheartened?  Or was everybody just not that interested?  But anyway, when voters of the left (or right) unite instead of splitting their vote, I think it&#8217;s fair to say that&#8217;s a swing.</p>
<p>@Keith, I don&#8217;t doubt they were at pains to stress it.  The Croats, Hungarians and Romanians say exactly the same thing.  Nobody wants to be in Eastern Europe.  </p>
<p>Doug M.</p>
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		<title>By: Keith</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14956</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 20:51:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14956</guid>
		<description>45 minutes west of Bratislava and you are in Vienna. When I was last there, they were at pains to stress that they live in "Central Europe", not "Eastern Europe" as the original article suggests.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>45 minutes west of Bratislava and you are in Vienna. When I was last there, they were at pains to stress that they live in &#8220;Central Europe&#8221;, not &#8220;Eastern Europe&#8221; as the original article suggests.</p>
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		<title>By: lemuel kolkava</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14955</link>
		<dc:creator>lemuel kolkava</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 16:40:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14955</guid>
		<description>Actually Slovakia did not "swing left", the "left" the national socialists of all stripes did receive about the same amount of votes as back in 2002, only at that time these forces were beset by internal struggles and thus many parties failed to appear in the parliament (Nationalists, two left-wing parties that later dissolved in SMER) allowing for a center-right coalition. (Also worth noting SDKU-DS did receive more percentage points of votes than in 2002) 

I must allways laugh when these necessary steps without which the country would in all probablity go bankrupt are described as radical and "neo-liberal".

"...this well trodden path that Europe appears to be realizing was a mistake?"

Steve, dont be silly. A road toward greater freedom and personal responsibility is hardly a mistake. And just becuase something gets voted for or against doesnt make it more or less truthful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually Slovakia did not &#8220;swing left&#8221;, the &#8220;left&#8221; the national socialists of all stripes did receive about the same amount of votes as back in 2002, only at that time these forces were beset by internal struggles and thus many parties failed to appear in the parliament (Nationalists, two left-wing parties that later dissolved in SMER) allowing for a center-right coalition. (Also worth noting SDKU-DS did receive more percentage points of votes than in 2002) </p>
<p>I must allways laugh when these necessary steps without which the country would in all probablity go bankrupt are described as radical and &#8220;neo-liberal&#8221;.</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;this well trodden path that Europe appears to be realizing was a mistake?&#8221;</p>
<p>Steve, dont be silly. A road toward greater freedom and personal responsibility is hardly a mistake. And just becuase something gets voted for or against doesnt make it more or less truthful.</p>
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		<title>By: Yusuf Smith</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14954</link>
		<dc:creator>Yusuf Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 05:15:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14954</guid>
		<description>Jobs may be going begging in the capital, but a few hours west, on the Ukrainian border

A few hours east, surely?  A few hours west of Bratislava and you're in Switzerland ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jobs may be going begging in the capital, but a few hours west, on the Ukrainian border</p>
<p>A few hours east, surely?  A few hours west of Bratislava and you&#8217;re in Switzerland &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Martens</title>
		<link>http://fistfulofeuros.net/afoe/governments-and-parties/slovakia-swings-left/#comment-14953</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Martens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 02:20:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://fistfulofeuros.net/wordpress/?p=2588#comment-14953</guid>
		<description>Will, you've obviously never heard of David Frum.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will, you&#8217;ve obviously never heard of David Frum.</p>
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